Revised Church and Clergy

[gaston]

[Overlooked Again]

Unfortunately, according to the latest rules, although Church wedding and funeral services last a week, only the officiating priest, bride/bridegroom and, presumably the person footing the bill for the funeral (since the corpse won't have any use for them) gets any SPs from them. This begs the question 'why should anyone bother going?' the obvious answer being 'they won't'.

Wouldn't it be far better to say that wedding receptions / wakes take place in the same week as the service and change the current rules:

15.12 Weddings

Wedding services gain SP for the clergy performing the ceremony and the groom. SL range determines which options are possible and necessary depending on the grooms SL. A NPC will always perform the ceremony if asked. Half of the cost paid go the clergy performing the ceremony, the rest goes to the church. Guests do not donate to the collection or gain SP for attending church though they may gain SP for attending the wedding. [I'm not sure what that last sentence even means]

15.13 Funerals

The clergy may also hold funerals, which work the same way as weddings. This is often followed by a wake at the deceased's club the following week, although this is not mandatory.

to

15.12 Weddings

Wedding services gain SP for the clergy performing the ceremony and the bride/groom. SL range determines which options are possible and necessary depending on the bride/groom's SL. An NPC will always perform the ceremony if asked. Half of the costs paid go the clergy performing the ceremony, the rest goes to the church. Guests do not donate to the collection or gain SP for attending the church service though they may gain SP for attending the wedding reception in the same week.

15.13 Funerals

The clergy may also hold funerals, which work the same way as weddings, SPs going to the officiating Priest and the character footing the bill. This is often followed by a wake at the club of the deceased (or the club or house of the character paying for the service) held in the same week, although this is not mandatory.

[Ymbert Montgomery]

This one's less overlooked and more that I think it could do with seeing if anyone else wants to contribute; I think it may have got lost in the megathread.

[gaston]

Well, all being well Helen will be getting married shortly, so the question for me is:

Is she going to have to waste a week arranging a pointless service that no-one will come to thanks to a needless nerf injected inexplicably into the previous draft rules? Or can the service take place in the same week as the wedding reception, as is the universal custom and as was the case until a needless nerf was inexplicably injected into the previous draft rules?

No brainer from where I'm sitting...

So, a plea to all Churchmen: If you don't want to have to waste weeks conducting services which no-one will attend, for minimal SPs, (when you could be giving sermons instead) for God's sake say something...

[Oh, and I guess that goes for anyone who thinks they might get married or arrange funeral for a deceased friend in the future too...]

[Ymbert Montgomery]

Apr 23, 2020 20:26:00 GMT gaston said:

Well, all being well Helen will be getting married shortly, so the question for me is:

Is she going to have to waste a week arranging a pointless service that no-one will come to thanks to a needless nerf injected inexplicably into the previous draft rules? Or can the service take place in the same week as the wedding reception, as is the universal custom and as was the case until a needless nerf was inexplicably injected into the previous draft rules?

Heh, it's not inexplicable. It's a straight cut and paste without much consideration.

Generally I agree it needs changing; just want to give people a chance to explore options other than the previous ones.

[gaston]

Apr 23, 2020 20:34:20 GMT Ymbert Montgomery said:

Heh, it's not inexplicable. It's a straight cut and paste without much consideration.

That's what I figured - unintentional oversight rather than deliberate policy. 

Generally I agree it needs changing

I know, that's why I was surprised to see that it was still there in the revised rules...  I was under the impression we'd agreed to drop it, hence the comment at the  head of the initial post? 

Every wedding and funeral I have ever been to has had the service and the reception / wake on the same _day_.

Every wedding and funeral an EG! character has ever been to has had the service and the reception / wake in the same week.

Having a service then waiting over a week before having the gathering connected to it just seems so _wrong_

[Ymbert Montgomery]

Apr 24, 2020 7:37:53 GMT gaston said:

Apr 23, 2020 20:34:20 GMT Ymbert Montgomery said:

Every wedding and funeral I have ever been to has had the service and the reception / wake on the same _day_.

Every wedding and funeral an EG! character has ever been to has had the service and the reception / wake in the same week.

Having a service then waiting over a week before having the gathering connected to it just seems so _wrong_

Definitely agreed to drop it. Just not quite agreed what's replacing it. That said, unless anyone has any big ideas on this I'll change it back to your idea after the next turn anyway. (Nothing it affects in May, whereas front likely means funerals).

[Ymbert Montgomery]

Doesn't seem to be any objection to this so I'll be putting in after the May turn.

[Yves Eau]

Separating the two events does seem unreasonable. If it seems there are too many SPs being given for weddings, we can look at this again, but it's not something we can do every month, so I very much doubt it will become an exploit.

[Ymbert Montgomery]

Although I may give a bonus SP to any priest who specialises in killing people in duels and then profiting from their funerals.

[Adam de la Bassée]

Apr 26, 2020 23:58:43 GMT Ymbert Montgomery said:

Although I may give a bonus SP to any priest who specialises in killing people in duels and then profiting from their funerals.

Not really able to type up my thoughts, stucknin backwoods Maine for the foreseeable.

Would appreciate a chance to, might be a week or so.

[Ymbert Montgomery]

That's fine; we'll hold fire.

[Adam de la Bassée]

Apr 27, 2020 9:52:17 GMT Ymbert Montgomery said:

That's fine; we'll hold fire.

No problem with the funeral wedding changes just have ideas for thickening the career path.

[huillaume]

Suggestion (while no urging, as it won't be used for several months at least):

To weddings and funerals, add Baptisms. The SL would depend on father's, and it should be done within a month of a child being born, but might be done for both children together in case of twins.

[Alain Andre Durant]

Maybe treat the wedding / funeral like a party (in the case of an Irish wake, definitely) as an opportunity to toady. The groom (or bride) would obviously be the guest of at the wedding, and perhaps the deceased (his last SL of record at the point of death) be the guest of honor at the funeral.

[gaston]

Just noticed that the chart detailing the chances of joining the different religious orders, according to SL, was overlooked re the latest draft...

Maybe treat the wedding / funeral like a party (in the case of an Irish wake, definitely) as an opportunity to toady. The groom (or bride) would obviously be the guest of at the wedding, and perhaps the deceased (his last SL of record at the point of death) be the guest of honor at the funeral.

Well, yeah, that's kinda the point of having the wedding reception / ball / wake in the same week as the service.